Episode Description
Join Dani as she breaks down what's working in marketing right now. From using school lessons to help businesses make a difference to the real deal on brands standing up for what's right and how not to get lost in the noise on social media. She'll also share stories about AI in her own business and a clever marketing campaign that got people talking.
Key Points:
- Everify's Approach: They create educational content that helps businesses teach important topics while promoting their brand.
- Genuine Brand Involvement: It's not just about taking a stand on issues; it's about being involved and making a real difference.
- Smart Social Media & Targeted Marketing: Understanding your audience isn't just a buzzword—it's about making sure your message is heard by the people who need to hear it.
- AI in Practice: Dani is figuring out how to use AI for more than just buzz—it's about making jobs easier and improving customer experience.
- A Campaign to Remember: Dani recounts a creative campaign that got attention by breaking the usual marketing mold and what made it resonate with people.
Check out the episode and subscribe for straightforward insights into today's marketing landscape. To learn more about how pharosIQ can help you reach your revenue goals, visit us here.
Follow Danielle Bruce on LinkedIn
Summary:
In this video, Danielle Bruce, Senior Director of Demand Generation at EverFi for Blackbaud, shares insights on social impact marketing, hyper-segmentation, and how AI helps personalize messaging. She explains EverFi’s approach to targeting educators and businesses, discussing the different challenges faced by large enterprises and smaller organizations.
[Read the full transcript]
pharosIQ: Welcome, welcome, welcome to this week's episode. The podcast for B2B marketers that is anything but boring. First recording of the new year, so if I'm a little bit rusty, please forgive me. That's a good thing we have, uh, Danielle on who's going to keep me on my toes. Danielle, uh, Bruce comes to us as the, uh, Senior Director of Demand Generation for EverFi for Blackbaud.
Um, you know, been there a couple of years now and really doing some awesome things. So let's, uh, let's get started. Tell us a little bit about, uh, EverFi, Danielle.
Danielle: Thank you. Um, yeah, so EverFi is a social impact company. Um, we primarily help purpose driven companies achieve their social impact and, and, and any business goals that they have.
Um, so we, we, generally will help them develop and deploy a trusted world class educational content, um, that is aligned to sort of the school curriculum and any kind of critical, um, education Themes that they they need
pharosIQ: god. So you know that you guys have historically served very specific vertical segments like k through 12 Is that um, let's start there.
Is that something that is still specific or if you've expanded beyond that?
Danielle: Um, we we actually have expanded a little bit. So we Generally in the k12 market we have two different audience segments. Um And we do marketing to teachers and educators, so we provide them with information about the breadth of our digital course programs.
Um, and then the second, the second audience segment is, is businesses that are looking for ways to give back to their communities. And that's done through their sponsorship of digital education programs. Um, and, you know, ultimately because our courses are free and a high need resource for teachers, our marketing to that audience becomes a little bit easier because it's more just about awareness and, um, being able to provide a network of services and on the ground support for them.
The business audience is a little bit more nuanced, so making it sort of harder for that broad based message. Um, but being able to provide community impact is really about focusing on the specific interests of an organization. So, um, being able to talk to that need is really sort of a crafted personalized message to make sure it's, uh, remains authentic to that brand.
pharosIQ: It's going to say like so for hyper segmentation, right? You hit your, your product is natively segmented into those, you know, what seems to be two very specific verticals, right? K through 12 and or companies who are looking to have some sort of charitable segment to it, right? Do you find it as a, as a marketer?
Harder or easier to have like a hyper segmented market to attack?
Danielle: Um, I actually find it easier. So I think being, especially now, um, with sort of AI and like, you know, a lot of the components of marketing You are able to really craft and personalize that message and if you're really sort of focused on the audience segment, you know who they are, you know who the persona is, you really can dive into that audience a little bit deeper with that hyper segmentation, um, and Yeah.
I mean, I think there's a place for a little bit of both, I guess, you know, especially with awareness, um, campaigns and things of that nature, um, you can kind of figure out, you know, what, where to put your marketing dollars, um, and, and what you want to sort of figure out as far as the audience segment goes.
pharosIQ: Sometimes, and it sounds counterintuitive, right? To have such a niche audience or, or such a specific market segment that it would be easier, but. I think one of the larger challenges that I've had over my career is, is in too big of an opportunity, right? You know, and, and when there's so much, again, when the ocean is so big, you tend to try to boil it versus just hyper focusing on the actual segment that you have the highest propensity to buy.
But when your product kind of does that for you, you're just so laser focused. Where are these people? How can I best reach them? And how can I do that most cost effectively? So I would agree with you, where I, if I had. Like just being able to laser focus on like, these are our buyers go find them versus trying to figure out of the masses who may be in the market for a product segment at that time, I would agree.
Danielle: Yeah, I mean, and we definitely, um, because we do have so many different products and so many different audiences, I think we, we definitely have like that ICP persona that we're like, Oh yeah, we, we know how to talk to them. And they have the. Specifics for how we want to provide value, but, you know, there are some potential opportunities in, in some other, um, market segments that potentially we haven't explored or, you know, they don't know who we are.
So, um, I think that's important to include, um, as well.
pharosIQ: The social advocacy side of the training is going to be coming more and more prevalent in large enterprises to for their individual, you know, for that for that segment. So I think that's a probably a burgeoning opportunity for you, which again, but that now you're opening up a whole can of worms.
What's a large enterprise? How many all of that, you know,
Danielle: Yeah, absolutely. And I, I think, you know, we, we definitely segment out our, our market audiences into, you know, small, medium sized businesses, mid market, um, and into enterprise because the challenges of, um, an enterprise business is not necessarily the, the budget, right?
It's, it's something that's a little bit more, Surrounding, um, the, the reporting side or like getting, um, uh, a product from, uh, go to market strategy. Um, you know, it's a very big timeline, um, for some of those larger organizations versus a smaller organization, which is just literally like, how much does it cost?
We want to know if we can afford that in our budget. Um, and, you know, or if we have the team to deploy something like that, you know, those are the kind of, um, ways that we think about those different segments.
pharosIQ: It's an, it's an interesting market you're into, you know, like And given that you're a social advocacy company, right, a social impact company, my question for you, it's an interesting one, right?
I found that what you're seeing is this pivot over the past year ish, maybe a couple of years, where brands almost have to have personalities and personalities or people almost have to have brands. Right. Um, and, and you're seeing a lot of companies not being forced to, but almost being responsible for having stances on social issues, right?
How does that, what are your thoughts on that as a marketer? Right. Um, how do you toe that line? Who makes those decisions on, you know, like, let's say customer facing stances on very polarizing social issues.
Danielle: Yeah. I mean, I think that's a really good point. I, I think consumers these days are much more savvy.
Um, and they want to follow and remain loyal to the brands that echo their own personal values. So because of this savviness, they can really spot when there's like what I call a brand deep fake, when brands try to jump on a bandwagon, try to jump on a bandwagon to share a post or something is that's inauthentic or completely out of left field, and they will call you out on it.
And so. you know, you have to be very, very careful, but I think there are some ways to tell these stories in a, in a better way. You know, for me, it's really all about action. So what is the, the brand or company doing? Um, for, for example, Under our Blackboard umbrella of companies, we have a company called Your Cause, which provides software, um, to allow brands to connect their employees with nonprofits through donations, volunteering, and corporate grant making.
So, um, because it's all in one platform, it's easy for them to look at the social impact. social issues that are important to their employees, which to me are the people that make up the brand, um, and what they most care about. And then at that point, the brand can then sort of Talk about those issues. Um, I'll put employees just volunteered X amount of hours or donated X amount of, of dollars to humanitarian relief, but you don't need to specifically call out your views, you know, you're just saying, Hey, this is how we're contributing.
Um, brand's humanity. And I think that's important for customers.
pharosIQ: Yeah. And it's, and again, there's so many landmines, right? As you mentioned earlier, like consumers, like just, I mean, generationally there's people that are just so savvy, right? Like, and again, I think you used a very key word authentic, right?
And I think authenticity comes with consistency, right? And again, when you see brands coming out of left field with massive social messages, it just seems again, you know, again, wave riding, right? We're almost like you're leveraging a social cause to. Drive revenue, right? Whereas we have some brands who are just consistent, consistently social advocates, right?
And those are the ones that have that, that real authentic ring to them, right? I think I said it in a LinkedIn post earlier this week, I think 2024. Is going to be the year of authenticity across b2b, right from marketing to customers from executives to employees from employees to bosses from leaders to peers Like I think everybody just wants a sense of just be authentic be who you are have candid conversations And I think that's a a roadmap for the next going forward.
Danielle: Yeah, I completely agree I mean the storytelling element is really you need to have a good story to tell um Authenticity is important, and I mean, with the amount of like, internet access and people going back through posts and things of that nature, like, If it's not authentic, you know, you never know what's going to come down the line.
And I think, you know, a lot of brands and organizations are kind of concerned with that. But if you're doing good work, if you're making an impact in your community, within your, your employment or your organization as, as an employer, that's, that's gold. People aren't gonna mess with that really.
pharosIQ: Is that final question on this topic?
Is that marketing's decision? Is it an executive's decision? Is it a combination? Is it a collective decision amongst a group of people at a company? How do you think that?
Danielle: Yeah. I mean, I think it's definitely, I think it's a little bit of, of both. I think, um, you know, and something that we've seen, um, from a number of our, our partners is, is the CEO has a personal story with, um, financial education, um, for example.
where, you know, they really wanted to provide, um, literacy or things of that nature because they had a personal story attached to something like that. And it doesn't necessarily, they may not be a finance company, but it's just something that they're passionate about and they want to provide that for their community and their local community, in fact, um, which is something that, uh, we also do is, um, Um, being able to be very specific and intentional about, um, what you're doing and who you're, um, impacting, I think, is, is, comes from the CEO, it also comes from, like, the chief, the C suite of chief executives, the board of directors, but also the employees, because those are the ones, uh, those are the people that are, are, uh, doing the work and spending the time and being sort of the brand and advocate, um, as well.
pharosIQ: With so many landmines, it's just, you know, I couldn't even imagine being a social media manager for a large brand, right? Like I couldn't, it would come to, you know, like, did I just say the wrong thing that blows up a key, you know, like, you know, like, I would, I would constantly be like, I'd have like a 17 step approval process.
Danielle: Yeah. I mean, I think the
pharosIQ: next 17 days somebody approved them. So it's not on me if something blows up.
Danielle: Right. Exactly. So I think a lot of, um, the larger organizations will lean into one and one thing only, and that's their, that's their North star. That's the one that they really want to focus on. And I mean, I think that's important for, for budget as well, because you can't help everyone as much as I would love for that to be a thing.
Um, being able to spend the dollars, um, is also a
pharosIQ: great thing to help every, you know, both for EverFi and the world in general. So,
Danielle: well, that's how we do that through our partners.
pharosIQ: Yeah.
Danielle: We help everybody.
pharosIQ: So your LinkedIn profile has you listed as a ABM strategist, right? So if I'm a new marketer or a new demand gen practitioner, which is probably pretty rare, but it happens all the time that I'm, I'm diving into ABM for the first time in 2024, right?
What is a, so what's a key piece, a couple of pieces of advice for me diving into ABM, given your experience? Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Danielle: Um, that's a great question. Uh, I think ABM is, you know, definitely very personalized and an intentional type of marketing. So you really have to understand who you're targeting and why.
Um, I generally will do maybe even too much research on who they are.
Sorry. All good. I'll, I'll start again. Um, pharosIQ, that's a great question. Um, I think ABM is definitely very personalized and intentional type of marketing. Uh, you really have to understand exactly who you're targeting and why. And, um, I generally will do a ton of research, probably too much research, um, use a lot of data insights.
To help me understand exactly what the message and potentially the channel that will resonate best with either a specific person or, uh, a specific, specific company. So I think those are kind of the, the, the way forward is, is do your research, make sure that the message you, uh, presenting to them is something that they will, uh, either identify with or at least intrigue them.
Um, and I think that those are probably the, the most important, especially, um, going into the new year where like personalization is everything in marketing at the, at the moment.
pharosIQ: Yeah. Maybe. I mean, I think ABM is going to hit a bit of a renaissance again, right? I think ABM five years ago was that true ABM, right?
That true one to one play, right? Where you have this targeted group of accounts that you know is a great fit for what you do. You know, there's a market for, you know, that, that you need to win. And then there's this really creative focus targeted one to one approach to turn those customers into opportunities, pipeline, and revenue.
And what happened about five years ago is there was a lot of marketers who started doing that and it worked. And then what happens when something works? Some damn executive comes in and says, okay, cool. Let's scale this. Right. But the function of ABM isn't scalable. That's why I think too many, you know, too many marketing teams as a ABM focused, like it can't be your whole strategy, right?
Just by the nature of what it is. It can't be the whole strategy for a demand gen, right? Because then it's, it's not one to one, it's not personal, it's not truly account based, right? So I think we're, we're reaching again a renaissance where I think a lot of companies have realized this. They've also realized that ABM isn't a platform.
It's not a software. It's not something that you could buy. It's not display ads. They've also, a lot of people have realized what it isn't. Unfortunately, it's cost a lot of companies, lots of hundreds of thousands of dollars to realize those things. And the true ABM marketers are going to start stepping up again with these really one to one programs.
And then, you know, like, again, understanding that there's still a ton of green field out there outside of your ABM list, because, you know, the other thing that's happening as well, too, is ABM marketing became a sales wishlist. Right. So instead of like, these people are actually trending, they have a high propensity to buy, they fit for what we do.
We can reach them, et cetera. It just became, ah, I want to sell these accounts, go marketing, do your marketing stuff and make me look, you know, so like, I think, um, I'm looking, I'm looking forward to it. Curious to your thoughts on that logic.
Danielle: Yeah, I mean, I completely agree. And I think also, you know, the help of AI, um, you know, is, is going to be able to sort of make some of those, um, those targeted messages a little bit easier on, on the side of, of the marketing folks.
Um, but yeah, I mean, I think, Also, I, I completely agree with your, I, the scalability of ABM, the nature of ABM is not scalability, that, that is kind of, uh, the opposite, an oxymoron, um, uh, so, yeah, I think, I think being able to, um, really sort of dive in deep, um, making sure that the data that you look at is, is correct and is able to, um, um, You know, tell a story on, on that company, um, and then, you know, building out your campaign, sort of supporting that and then, you know, people can't really say no to numbers.
I mean, you're like, here's the thing, here's the proof, you know, and so that's why I generally tend, tend to lean in there a little bit.
pharosIQ: It's not advice, but they do all the time. The longer you do, the longer you do something and the higher you go up the chain, you'd be surprised how many people don't look at the actual numbers and just go with whatever it is that they think.
So you mentioned it briefly and we won't cover a ton because everybody's talking about it, but how's your company tackling AI, right? Is it, you know, how's that looking?
Danielle: Yeah. I mean, so I, since EverFi falls under the BlackBot umbrella, um, we've, the, the greater organization has kind of come together in a task force.
And so we've got a number of different folks from multiple verticals, multiple teams, marketing folks, um, sales folks, all, everyone from, um, all areas of the business. Um, and I'm super excited. about what we've been learning and what we're sort of doing as far as that goes and and how AI can help specifically me, my team, how we can optimize our processes because, you know, as I mentioned, I definitely see an opportunity Um, for versioning, personalization of content pieces, but, um, the one thing that I have learned is that I, I honestly, I don't think AI can do my job because when I look at some of the output of these things, I'm like, where did they, this even come from?
Like, this doesn't make any sense. It doesn't have a great propensity to navigate through large, areas of data. So like being able to, to make a connection, um, it doesn't work very well. It also, there's like, you know, I'm sure you're aware of like the whole hallucinations thing that AI provides where it can tell you information, but it can't tell you information about where it came from.
Um, So I think, I think for me, like the advantage is to, to be able to understand AI's capabilities, to be able to use it to do my job. Um, and then, you know, potentially for other people that, um, it could be come like a competitive edge when you're, you know, job seeking.
pharosIQ: It's a really, I've found that we've, we're at compliment phase, right?
Um, to the point where You know, just having knowledge about it. I, I'm, I use it like almost like a, you know, like I'd said this in a previous podcast, you're staring at the screen, you have to write something and it's just blinking at you and you're at a mock, right? Sometimes I'll be like, write this for somebody and I'm like, okay, like I'll get something going and then I'll just change it completely.
But it got my brain moving at least. But I like the, I like the task force, right? Bringing.
Danielle: Yeah.
pharosIQ: Different groups and divisions and people together to all talk about all of that collectively versus I think right now, AI is very siloed. How does finance use it? And I'm, I'm actually the idea and talking to my team, my, my CFO about just hiring a manager of AI, you know, somebody who just at the company, like spends their entire day brainstorming, how to use.
AI tech to make all of the different segments of the business better. And then approaching, Hey, sales manager, have you thought about this? I could build this for you. Sound good, right? Hey, marketing. I could do this because I think what happens is most of the time, like we all have a very rudimentary understanding of it based on what we read and what we play around with, where there's folks who always go beyond the rudimentary.
And having someone on staff who's beyond that, who can be like, Hey, you're way under utilizing this, right? Why don't I think that's, that'll be a position. I think more companies. Especially smaller and mid level are going to start hiring large companies, large companies. I think those will be teams, right?
Right. Like similar, but it's not all too different than, you know, having teams of software developers and coders and, and all of that segments, right. And just taking the tools that they can use to make all of the different segments of the business better. Right. So.
Danielle: Yeah. I mean, the other, the other part of AI is, is, um, you know, security, like if you're a business that deals with, you know, data, sensitive data, like you need to make sure, like, where is this information gonna be?
Um, and so I think that is something that also needs to, companies need to think about when they're sort of, um, for marketing, it's, you know, okay, here's, Here's a, a bunch of words that don't necessarily, um, mean anything, but if you're inputting, um, you know, as I said, anyone's sensitive information, like healthcare companies, that kind of thing, um, yeah, it could become, you know, a risk factor.
Um, so I think having a task force with many different people with different brain, left, right brain side, um, can be able to sort of institute that logic, um, to sort of an AI plan for the business.
pharosIQ: Cause I had never thought of it when we, you know, like we're part of a larger company as well. And I was like, you know, like they're, they had very specific rules put in place and usage and that I was like, what is the, and I'm like, well, like, and then I was reading that, you know, people were lawyers were putting.
legal documents into it for review and coders were putting code in for review. Like, Oh, you probably don't want to do that. Like, that's probably not great. So like, once I thought about that, I was like, Oh, okay. I get it now. So awesome. So 100 percent tax section of the podcast, right. Where we talk about un, unboring B2B campaigns.
You've been doing this a while. Work in very specific markets, a little bit broader markets. You've worked in the U. S. You've worked in Australia. You've worked a lot of different places. Um, tell me about one of your favorite unboring campaigns. What did you like about it? Did it work? Did it not? The world would love to know.
Danielle: Excellent. Um, so I think Probably my, my favorite, um, unboring campaign was when we, um, so it was to do with ABM. Um, so we basically, um, went through and did all our research on a company. Um, I won't, I'm gonna hold out the name, but, uh, we basically provided, uh, uh, A full scale look at how, um, the future would look if we partnered together.
So we actually provided a. Um, a pseudo newspaper that, that showed, um, what this partnership was going to look like, how it was going to provide them with, um, all of these different insights, all of this different social impact, and then basically show how they changed the world. And so one of the things that I love about MFI is that we, we have the power to be able to, um, you know, provide that, that message to, you know, K 12 audiences, adults, um, and be able to sort of expand that message.
And so we really wanted to like showcase the power of that. And so we, we put together like a completely different newspaper. Um, it was all digital, but I would love to do an actual newspaper. Um, and. Uh, and just, you know, show, show what that impact could look like, because it's, it's very compelling when you kind of hyper focus on that type of thing, as well as sort of escalate what your imagination can provide.
Um, so that was definitely one of my favorites.
pharosIQ: I mean, really, really cool, right? Like a, a future state.
pharosIQ 3: Yes.
pharosIQ: Like, I love, I mean, again, there's so much noise right now, right? I mean, like, again, you probably get 17 emails a day that say the words ROI, you know. AI or, you know, one of 17 buzzwords in them that it just becomes like just sleepy time, right?
Someone randomly hits you up with something. It's like your business 12 months from now. Exactly.
Danielle: Yeah. And I mean, it's, it's a, it's a good way to like, Help them visualize, um, what, what they're, they can do. And I think a lot of companies can sometimes get bogged down in minutiae, um, where they're not really sort of understanding what that can do.
Um, so I, yeah, I, I think that's probably, um, my way of at least trying to, to, to show them the opportunities that are, that are there.
pharosIQ: I love this part of this, of the show. Cause again, the whole purpose of the podcast is really just to inspire, right? Almost all of the ideas I've ever had in my career usually come from listening to someone else's idea and either a stealing it or be modifying it and making it just a smidge better.
Right. Like head immediately turns to like, imagine here, if you like, if you just sent somebody an email with the subject line that said, congrats on being marketer of the year. And then like, I mean, again, if you got that, you're opening it at least, but then the first line is, well, not yet, but if you work with us, you probably have a chance, right?
Like, I mean, I'm taking that meeting, right. And I think that's where we need to get back to from a demand and a marketing standpoint, right? Because I love AI and I love automation and I love all the tools for both the selling and a marketing standpoint. But. You know, it's like path of least resistance, right?
Everyone's gonna go to the, to the worst possible use case of great tools. And then unfortunately kill a lot of their creativity that happens at B2B. So really awesome, uh, really awesome use case. I think again, for sellers out there, you know, feel free to take my. X of the year award winner idea and put that in the subject line.
I might, I
Danielle: might take it.
pharosIQ: I might dabble with this before the podcast comes out. Right. And just kind of throw it out there and see what works. Right. But. But that's my favorite part. So thank you so much for sharing that story. I was inspired to a new idea. Hopefully somebody else out there is inspired for a new idea of themselves.
And again, I think ABM Renaissance is coming. So with that, um, you know, Danielle, thank you so much for joining. It was really awesome having you join us, right. We'll probably be coming to you in a couple of weeks after we, you know, get through all of the motions and edits on that side, but, uh, where can, uh, our folks.
Listening, find you or ever if I at should they be looking?
Danielle: add my link, uh, if you want to share that in the podcast message. Um, I think that's the best way, to reach me. Um, send me a quick message. If you have a cool idea, I'm happy to, um, go into the weeds. I love, I love this stuff.
pharosIQ: Connect with uh, danielle on linkedin. You can find mrp on linkedin as well.
You can also find us at mrpfd Wherever you're listening to your podcast whether it be spotify apple music wherever click the subscribe button to come back and hear me Again, and or give us a five star review the more of those That pop up the more people hear my wonderful voice each and every week and folks like Danielle bringing us with the goods, right?
So thanks to, uh, Danielle. We look forward to connecting again soon and, uh, look forward to, uh, chatting with everybody else in the meantime. All right.
Danielle: Thanks, pharosIQ. Thank you. We're going to stop recording now. If I can find the button.
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